HQ Killers story

[sh4753]

A few days ago my sqd had an interesting battle. Overall we prefer to stay from humans...well some people can't handle defeat. In fact I had sqd members tell me their renown was dropped right after they had beaten human players. Complaining about the tactics my sqd had used and filed a complaint to microsoft...yeah that will drop your renown. Well anyways after multiple CPU 3v3 wins we decited for a challenge and took on a sqd of three humans. We were on a mission against Sal Kar at a hilly desert patch. We had a dedicated sniper, a soldier, and myself a HG/sniper breed. This one of the areas we had been in multiple times against the CPU so we pretty much knew which HQ a smart person would take for defence. Myself and one of my sniper sqd member headed forward up a ridge to view the battlefield. Usually from this vantage point we had about 80% covered for scouting purposes. Our soldier member stayed back until we confirmed targets and cleared the HQ. After like three minutes of nothing we decited that they may be playing a COMBASS, hold the HQ sort of a game. So myself and our soldier spread east and west to confirm their HQ location while our sniper stayed on the ridge covering us and keeping an eye on our HQ from distance. Not 30seconds later we hear "Pile Runners, Pile Runners, all three, fast movers, one a wheeler, and two hovers...going right for our base." The only thought going thru my head was crap, we lost. Our sniper did incredible though taking the two hovers mobility in no time, which bought our soldier and myself the time we needed to return to HQ. As I came back into view of our HQ the wheeler was already on station causing havok, and the HQ began to smoke. While our sniper still concentrated on the hovers, I jumped into sniper mode while moving towards the base. I don't know how I got so lucky but two salvos and his dule piles were gone. I could tell he was :):):):)ed, he turned towards me and started a daring assault with quad miniguns. Well if he would have had some longer range vision he would have seen my duel cannon. One salvo landed to his right, but the other one landed in his face. At this point m snipers were reloaded and one salvo to the cockpit finished him. Unfortunatly our HQ was smoking pretty bad already and I still had doubts about salvaging this one. The remaining two hovers were about 200 yards out from our HQ when our soldier popped over the ridge and offloaded his rockets into one. He was a goner! Our sniper succesfully took the other hovers generator out from behind so he was determined to kill our base, but was creeping along now. Easy pickings, we all zeroed in and five seconds later he was gone. We discussed this one for like 10 minutes after the battle and we knew how close we had gotten to bitting the dust. Plus with pile firepower like that, if they had chosen to come after us indivitually especially since we spread out they could have had us in no time. P.S. As much as I know that HQ killing is part of the game, taking on your opponend is where your true skill and tactics shine. The HQ thing is almost cheating in feel. Our squad will only concentrate on the enemy HQ if we find it empty with no enemy in sight and we feel that we have been circled. Because we make it known that we want to kill you and not your HQ!

[Philaroni]

Ya what i think is that you should have to kill the hounds and if you kill the base to then you get like a big bonus in $$ and reown and XP in 6 on 6 matches 90% of the games we get based rushed suck a$$

[jjbuj]

"The HQ thing is almost cheating in feel" Obviously you miss the point of this game. This game was designed for tactics in mind. win by whatever means nessessary if that means capturing combasses or base destruction. those are in there for balance.You just want to rush out looking for someone to shoot. Your opponent with a scout or soldier see's your defender or dbl barrel inverse or hvgunner and is cheap for not taking you on?
Did you play the story mode or read the manual? Tarakia, Sal Kar, and Morskoj have outsourced their Armies to Mercs. We are all Mercs! Mercs who work for the same Organization. Your Fighting Coworkers. Mercs do it for the money not out of Patriotism or self sacrifice.

My squad fought one battle where my treaded hound loaded with rifles and shotguns rode right by a sniper on a hill 100 meters from his base and destroyed it with him in my view the whole time. I didn't even move around. He was too preoccupied with my squad mate off in the distance to notice me shooting his base with shotguns!
We lost another battle In Qara where Me and an Enemy Sniper were all that were left. he captured combasses while I followed closely shooting him from behind until I eventually ran out of ammo. What infuriated me was that he wasn't destroyed or even heavily damaged from my prolonged onlsaught.
I can understand exclusive hound vs hound fights in Free Battle but not in the Nueromis War.

[Tylendel]

So basically, what you're saying is that you almost got your teeth kicked in tactically, and so you want something done to help you.



Join the other hundreds of posters who whine about this, though I will say three pilers is kind of cheap.

[Kard]

no, its not cheap or cheating or anything like that. Having three different methods to win brings demension to the game. It means you can just build slow tough armoured heavy guned mechs, you have to go in with a strategy and different mech types to attack and counter all three methods of winning. If you are outgunned and win by cocmbas that is a good victory, if one group is going to sit at their HQ with triple canon multiped mechs then they deserve to lose by combas, if you send every mech out for combat and leave your base defensless then you deserver to have it destroyed by a machine gun two pile scout.

I have many a story where i snatched victory from the jaws of defeat by retreating from a battle to go steal combas for a win or sneaking around a battle to find no one watching their HQ. Ive also lost by every means, there is no cheap way out of the three victories. If you couldnt win by destroying HQs or taking combas, no one would defend HQs, capture combas, or design mechs that are weaker but faster or pilot HQ destroying mechs. This game has many facets and saying that only fighting face to face in a mech fight is the only non cheap victory is errorgant and boring. I like having strategies and counter strategies to win instead of just double double mech and bash it out.


So basically, what you're saying is that you almost got your teeth kicked in tactically, and so you want something done to help you.


lol, put perfectly. also, if 3 pilers rush your base, if you have even one well designed defender hound, those 3 pilers are toast. I was in a clan match 3 v 3. And we left 1 guy as defender with an NA and one HUGE cannon on multiped legs going only 74 speed. That one mech destroyed all 3 pilers. Also had one defender with an NA and 1 heatseaker weapon defend against 2 pilers and win. just got be smart, not strong.

[Neverwind]

There is still a difference between cheap and cheating. Cheating sucks. Being cheap is something that is flung around a lot these days.

Pile rushing is cheap, using smoke bombs even moreso. However, it is a legitimate way to win.

Double-doubles are also an infuriatingly cheap design. But it is still a legitimate build. Although I have serious doubts about the physics of a game where you can stick enormous guns like that on reverse jointed legs and not have the thing fall on its :):):) every time it fires both guns at once.

For those who claim :):):):) as cheap, get over it. It's the way things work and if you can't handle it... stop playing.

[AngryCheese]

Very interesting Neverwind. So you have compiled a list of tactics/builds and categorized them?

Cheap:
Legitimate but Cheap:
Illegitimate and Cheap:
Unfair but Legitimate:

So now what all fits into what categories? I'm dying to know this from an 'expert' who didn't have anything to do with designing the game or defining what the objectives would or should be. Especially since you feel that doubles are legit and smoke is not. :roll:

Me, I take into account that every build is legitimate. Some are very easy to use against most opponents, but that is not a flaw. It's just reality. I could be okay with seeing Doubles made a lot heavier, but there's no build or combination that is unbeatable or overwhelming. Even my little twin sniper armed scout that explodes when someone sneezes a mile away has taken out double-double designs. It's not the build, it's the pilot.

[Getya]

Pile rushing is cheap, using smoke bombs even moreso. However, it is a legitimate way to win.

Pile rushing, when spammed, can be considered cheap by some. It isn't. You left your base, that is a victory condition, undefended. Nuff said there.

Now your saying smoke is cheap? Why? Because the little scout who can't take any dmg at all is trying to find ways around getting hit and this is cheap? AHAHAHAH.

Next it will be, oh this guy has a T1, so cheap, his connection is better than man, boy is that cheap.

WoW. You have just as many options as everyone else, anything is viable and has the ability to be effective in battle if used properly. Smoke mortarts cheap? Are ppl that use NVG on night maps cheap because you didn't put on NVG? NOPE, same thing with thermo, they are capitalizing on your mistakes, aka great strategy. I applaud these ppl.

Btw, we use smoke. See you on the battlefield.

[la_kais666]

The objective is to destroy the base. Maybe next time you won't all run out in the middle of the battlefield. Most people from Sal Kar will involve speed in their strategy (hence why they went to sal kar)

[Neverwind]

Very interesting Neverwind. So you have compiled a list of tactics/builds and categorized them?

Cheap:
Legitimate but Cheap:
Illegitimate and Cheap:
Unfair but Legitimate:

So now what all fits into what categories? I'm dying to know this from an 'expert' who didn't have anything to do with designing the game or defining what the objectives would or should be. Especially since you feel that doubles are legit and smoke is not. :roll:

Me, I take into account that every build is legitimate. Some are very easy to use against most opponents, but that is not a flaw. It's just reality. I could be okay with seeing Doubles made a lot heavier, but there's no build or combination that is unbeatable or overwhelming. Even my little twin sniper armed scout that explodes when someone sneezes a mile away has taken out double-double designs. It's not the build, it's the pilot.


:):):):) y'all and your inability to listen. I said as much that the builds are legit, just cheap as hell.

[dj_faceplant]

Isn't it all just tactics? I mean, really? The way you build your hounds/squads is just tactics. There's nothing cheap or underhanded or unfair about pretty much any of the builds or tactics in this game. Because that's what it is.. Tactics...

nuff said..


Peace

[Firefan43]

Any time someone mentions anything about pikers, everyone has to jump in and completely freak out. He thinks Pikers charging bases are a cheap tactic. Thats his opinion. you think pikers are a valid tactic, thats your opinion. Why do people get so uptight about it.

[alantkh]

For my case,

I think pile spiking is only cheap in 1v1. It basically reduces the 1v1 game into a VERY boring game. Especially if the piler is grabbing combass and waiting you to leave the base. There is NO TACTIC to win other than using a hound tha goes like 250+ ....

For 2v2 and above, piles is not much of an issue. Seriously, if you play the top squads, not many people use piles to rush the base. There are more effective ways to destroy the base like KE canons, heavy canons. Things that are fearsome to both hounds and HQs.

With piles, you really need surprise and it is hard to surprise in a many player game

[PSYGHOST]

Actually you can just grab a sniper and blow them up in a few shots!

[Caltendorf]

They deserve to get beat running a full team of pile hounds. Unfortunately for you, you didnt use good tactics in a 3 on 3 by leaving your base unguarded and not using a commander for a live match with humans. And no a sniper is not a good base defender.

You dont need help by devs you need better tactics. No offense intended just some constructive criticism.

[Dr Shakalu21]

From the battles I"ve played with the guys in my new squad base destruction is our main goal in every battle. If your fighting 2 enemies in a 3 person match and you don;t know where the third is you should defend your base. Sadly most people do the opposite.

Nothing is cheap. Its just something you weren't prepared for.

[Dark_Goru]

When it comes down to pile I encourage for the enemy to use them against me I am a scout but I go for hound kills for me piles just mean an easy kill. For piles it all comes down to how long you are willing to wait before leaving your base in a last ditch effort to gather combass/kill hound/destroy base. Its alot different when playing with four or more players and having a well balanced team. Can be quite frustrating if your using something slow and protecting your base in and 1v1 match. I just sit and wait for people to move away from their base and come on to my field so that ACV's keep them busy and I run up behind them and shoot em. I can understand that all pile team is quite cheap as is an all double cannon team but people play to win and you have to try to find a way around it. (Ive never beaten an all double cannon squad with 4 players or more though)

[curlyjoe345]

There is still a difference between cheap and cheating. Cheating sucks. Being cheap is something that is flung around a lot these days.

Pile rushing is cheap, using smoke bombs even moreso. However, it is a legitimate way to win.

Double-doubles are also an infuriatingly cheap design. But it is still a legitimate build. Although I have serious doubts about the physics of a game where you can stick enormous guns like that on reverse jointed legs and not have the thing fall on its every time it fires both guns at once.

For those who claim as cheap, get over it. It's the way things work and if you can't handle it... stop playing.

Neverwind if ur from Chaos Marines than what the hell r u talking about u guys have disconnected on my clan mates before!!!!!

[Evewalker [DR Elite]]

For my case,

I think pile spiking is only cheap in 1v1. It basically reduces the 1v1 game into a VERY boring game. Especially if the piler is grabbing combass and waiting you to leave the base. There is NO TACTIC to win other than using a hound tha goes like 250+ ....


Unfortunately, if you don't run something fast capable of destroying a base in 1v1, you'll be eaten alive by a DD unless you brought one yourself, which in that case, the match is even more boring than if you were trying to catch a scout. I have no problem bringing a scout into a 1v1 game for this very reason. I enjoy watching a DD stumble around the map trying to catch me before blowing his house up.

[Cereboralbore]

Take away base rushing/combas towers, and you dumb the game down to both squads marching towards one another with a short battle to ensue.

[Firefan43]

Take away base rushing/combas towers, and you dumb the game down to both squads marching towards one another with a short battle to ensue.

so, skirmishing and fighting each other is the game dumbed down? Seems to me like pile rushing, in any form, is so one dimensional that it would be what someone calls the game "dumbed down"

Fighting a good squad, actually fighting, is incredibly fun. Last night we did a 5 on 5 where both teams were pretty evenly matched with a mix of snipers, solders, HG's, and a commander on each side. Tactics were actually used. Our commander gave orders. he called in artillery strikes. Our soldeirs met their solders and fought them with the support of our HG while our sniper held off their sniper. The battle lasted about 10 minutes with both teams gaining and losing ground. in the end, our side was victorious, but both sides had fun. I sent and received a "Great Game" from one of the members of the opposing squad.

To me, thats what the game is about.

[schufflerbot]

lol

this type of argument cracks me up. you want to know what cheap is?
gas chambers, chemical warfare, night vision goggles, automatic rifles, machine guns, body armor, etc...

its all 'cheap' by the standards most of you are claiming as your own. the thing to remember is... they all win wars.

each tactic a squad uses is implemented for one reason: to win.

if it's in the game, use it. if your design is labeled as 'cheap' then rejoice in the fact that you've [BLAM]ed someone off so much, that they're going to whine about it for the next week and a half.

complaining about someones abilities being greater than your own is just sad.

thats like the special olympics asking the standard olympics to 'make the runners wear cowboy boots in the relay races, as the poor tards cant touch their times otherwise.'

yah, sounds rediculous, right?

so do these complaints.

[SneaKe]

thats like the special olympics asking the standard olympics to 'make the runners wear cowboy boots in the relay races, as the poor tards cant touch their times otherwise.'


ROFL. I would love to watch that, especially during the ice events!

[STABBING]

if you and the enemy squad shooting are in a fire fight, and all of a sudden a scout pulls up to your side and 1 shots you with a bunch of piles would it be cheap or amazing tactics

[evilsquirrel91]

Pilerushes are laughable now. I was in a two vs two on some desert map (not sure what). Both me and my partner split up and I noticed a pilerush soon on. I immediately informed my partner and he went back to base. I was fighting both pilers alone with a QC that had two mortars. One of them lost all their weapons, one lost their hover base and started running, but we chased him down. It was an extremely easy win.

In another instance, I was on South Cemo Oil Field. We noticed a piler and let him get closer to think he was going to make it to the base. With a mortar shot to make him stop and a QC straight to the weak pit, he died right there. He had like 8 or 9 piles on wheels. With these pilers thinking "OMG I can totally kill a base in 20 seconds!", they're neglecting how easy it is to comb across the map and find them on their way over, then own them with their little c-pits.